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Latest post 11-20-2009 8:35 AM by Gibson Brown. 191 replies.
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  • 10-08-2009 4:00 PM In reply to

    • Nick Prout
    • Top 10 Contributor
      Male
    • Joined on 01-17-2009
    • Panelist - Roanoke County
    • Posts 388

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Gibson Brown:
    Did anyone else see the incredible sunrise this morning? We sure live in a beautiful part of the world.
     

    Gip, I caught the show this morning grinding up Flat Top (elev 3252) at 29mph on the WV Turnpike heading for Huntington. It was quite a sight from that altitude. It must have been one of those cosmic moments as Flat Top is often  in the soup at that time of the a.m. Good stuff!

    Nick

     

     

     Don't Breed or Buy while Shelter Animals Die

      

  • 10-08-2009 4:22 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Nick..."Gip, I caught the show this morning grinding up Flat Top (elev 3252) at 29mph on the WV Turnpike heading for Huntington. It was quite a sight from that altitude. It must have been one of those cosmic moments as Flat Top is often  in the soup at that time of the a.m. Good stuff!"

    Hey Nick, king of the highway, I bet that was quite a sight from there. You may well know, we(NASA) sent what may as well be a missile into a 2 mile deep crater on the dark side of the moon this morning around 7:00 local, looking to verify quantities of ice, which would change things. It would not only change the way we perceive the moon, but would also be huge as far as potential potable water, rocket propellant capabilities, and how the base thing evolves. Cool stuff. I'm looking forward to see what Richard C. and the Coast to Coast gang have to say about it. You don't here squat via the mainstream media other than a blurb or two. I won't go there. Next subject...I had coffee with Joe C, and I was so very impressed. My first impression of him as you may remember, was one of his fine pups trying to hump one of my fine pups. He is quite a man, a great conversationalist, and we are lucky to have him on this panel. I still say he is "scary smart." Glad you made it home safely...again. Gip

     

    Keep your eye on the balland swing it like you mean it.

  • 10-08-2009 4:22 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Nick Prout:

    Gibson Brown:
    Did anyone else see the incredible sunrise this morning? We sure live in a beautiful part of the world.
     

    Gip, I caught the show this morning grinding up Flat Top (elev 3252) at 29mph on the WV Turnpike heading for Huntington. It was quite a sight from that altitude. It must have been one of those cosmic moments as Flat Top is often  in the soup at that time of the a.m. Good stuff!

    Nick

    Nick and Gip,

    What is this "sunrise" thing whereof you speak?  Perhaps it is something experienced only by crepuscular lifeforms.

    ..
    JoeC

     

     

    "Mistah Kurtz - he dead."

  • 10-08-2009 4:29 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Joe C..."What is this "sunrise" thing whereof you speak?  Perhaps it is something experienced only by crepuscular lifeforms."

    Nick, see what I mean about the "scary smart?" Gip

    Keep your eye on the balland swing it like you mean it.

  • 10-08-2009 5:21 PM In reply to

    • Nick Prout
    • Top 10 Contributor
      Male
    • Joined on 01-17-2009
    • Panelist - Roanoke County
    • Posts 388

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Gibson Brown:

    Joe C..."What is this "sunrise" thing whereof you speak?  Perhaps it is something experienced only by crepuscular lifeforms."

    Nick, see what I mean about the "scary smart?" Gip

     

     Gip, what Joe the good pilot refers to is people who get out of the sack before 9am.

     Don't Breed or Buy while Shelter Animals Die

      

  • 10-08-2009 5:26 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Nick Prout:

    Gibson Brown:

    Joe C..."What is this "sunrise" thing whereof you speak?  Perhaps it is something experienced only by crepuscular lifeforms."

    Nick, see what I mean about the "scary smart?" Gip

     

     Gip, what Joe the good pilot refers to is people who get out of the sack before 9am.

    Close.

    "Mistah Kurtz - he dead."

  • 10-08-2009 6:15 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Fine Panel, I know I swore I'd zip it, but this is something I felt was germane to our topic. Was walking the pups with Joanna, and we received a phone call from the City of Salem Schools. The recording went on to tell about how they were offering a free H1N1 shot for any student. They were not sure if it would be the "mist" up the nose, or the traditional "shot," but it was coming. They are sending permission slips home for each student to have signed. They did mention that Salem has had an excellent attendance ratio through today. Gip

    Keep your eye on the balland swing it like you mean it.

  • 10-08-2009 8:27 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Tanya Villani:
     
    Dave Hanson:
    I'll continue to chime in on the discussion topics, and the panel will just have to endure (and hopefully forgive) my occasional grumpiness. 
     

     Dave, thats why we like you so much, for your honesty.  I have missed everyone!!  I dont have as much time as I had before, but I still am part of this group.  That is if you will still have me.   

    Dave Hanson:
    And we have our second wedding in less than six months (October 10), so my wife is going crazy, and that affects me.
       Dave, I hope and pray this will be another blessed day for you and your family.  I have much catching up to do!!  ~Tanya 
     

    Dear Tanya and Dave,

    This fall seems to have been exceedingly challenging for a number of panelists.  It has worried me that our numbers have dwindled this month and we as a group have disappointed Luanne.  It reassures me to hear you too are facing work and family challenges.  It seems I am destined to continue my visits to local doctors and medical facilities this month.  Today at my mother's PCP office, the doctors and nurses looked battle weary -- they noted widespread flu cases -- predominately children.  I also saw a lot of tired looking parents toting miserable tots.  My visit pretty well validated the article in the RT today. 

    P.S to Mr. Nick,

    I have witnessed every sunrise that was visible since last Wednesday.  I get up at 5:30 a.m. and drive to the farm to help my mother give her cat, Goldie, an insulin shot.  Goldie was diagnosed with diabetes last week;  with Mom's limited vision and arthritis -- mastering insulin shots has been tough.  Goldie is responding well -- Mom and I not so well.  Although seriously sleep deprived, I did manage to yawn a WOW this morning!

    Sharron Smith

       PS-- I neglected to add I have been invited to participate in jury duty and the circus is returning to town next week.  Ah, the retired life!

     

  • 10-08-2009 8:41 PM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Sharron Smith:
    I have witnessed every sunrise that was visible since last Wednesday

     I just hate those invisible sunrises, don't you?

    ..
    JoeC

    "Mistah Kurtz - he dead."

  • 10-09-2009 12:45 AM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    David Horn:

    I guess I missed the boat on what I was trying to say.  I was trying to point at the pharmaceutical industry as being more hubristic than malicious.  They have an inordinate faith in their abilty  to do good.  It may be a 'net good', rather than an absolute one, but that's the nature of hubris, isn't it?

     

    David,

    Thanks for clearing that up. So for big pharma we have to ponder whether their motives are hubristic, malicious or monetary. I think, all three, but one's personal opinion or experience would determine how they split percentage wise. I hate to get into another long winded discussion, and I apologize in advance, but my experience says monetary, while being malicious as a tool to an end.

    Based on the actions they have taken, it would be proper to conclude that big pharma has always considered vitamins, supplements, and herbs as competitors for their market, and has attempted to stiffle them. As covered in my earlier post, pharma controls the FDA and uses it as a tool to try to achieve their objectives.

    I have been a vitamin user for many years. The following is my best recollection of the early FDA bullying, and some recent actions.

    In the early 1970's, Nobel Laureate Linus Pauling, PhD explained that almost all animals, except man, have working genes for self generation of vitamin C. So for good health, man should supplement in quantities equivalent per pound of their weight to what other animals produce. This was typically about 1,000 mg daily, but needed to be higher if the person was ill, and was safely self limiting by bowel tolerance. At that same time, the physician Shute brothers, were touting the heart attack prevention potential of supplementary vitamin E. To cut off all that nonsense, the FDA proclaimed rules that vitamin supplements must be limited to amounts needed to prevent known deficiency diseases, such as 30 mg or so of C to prevent scurvy, and a similar tiny amount for E.  

    In 1976, Senator William Proxmire, a primary health advocate, authored what is now known as the Proxmire Amendment, which overruled the FDA, and was really a bill of rights for dietary supplements. It was passed by voice vote in both chambers, with no dissenters. The FDA has made many attempts to subvert this law, but so far has been unsuccessful.  

    In the early 1990's the FDA got serious about trying to shut down the supplement industry. They set up a gun toting enforcement group which performed raids on manufacturers in attempts to find violations of any rules they could think up. The culmination, to set a scary example to other doctors, was in May 1992, a guns drawn raid on the medical clinic of the man who was probably the world's leading authority of non-pharmaceutical medicine at that time, Dr Jonathan V Wright. They bullied his staff and patients, and commandeered his computers, records and supplies and effectively tried to put him out of business. Their complaint was that he was using an unauthorized supplement; which turned out to be vitamin B injectables imported from Germany -- which he used because they were purer than what was available domestically. No charges were ever filed against him, and his equipment was never returned, but the outrage in congress and in the newspapers put a stop to these Gestapo type raids. Dr Wright and his clinic recovered, and he is still an outstanding spokesman for non-pharma approaches to health protection.

    The nonsense still goes on. Merck, from a yeast base, developed the cholesterol lowering statin Mevacor, whose active agent is the chemical lovastatin. The natural food industry had for many years been utilizing a natural product, red rice yeast, for cholesterol reduction. Merck/FDA analysis found that red rice yeast also contained lovastatin, so in 1999 they decreed that because lovastatin was part of an FDA approved drug, the natural yeast was also a drug and was illegal unless they submitted it to the multi-million dollar drug approval process. This effectively shut down the tiny red rice yeast market to protect big pharma's sales.

    Even more ludicrous, On October 17, 2005, the FDA sent warning letters to 29 companies that market cherries. They warned that they had to remove the scientific information on their web sites that cherries contained such things as anthocyanins which reduce inflammation, as making health claims classified them as drugs which must have FDA approval to be sold in the United States. So, according to FDA logic, you are not entitled to know what foods are good for you.

    One last note, which is more than malicious. Statin suppliers found that the statins not only suppressed the production of cholesterol, but that the same pathway suppressed the production of Coenzyme Q10.  CoQ10 is a basic component needed for maintenance of muscle, and other functions. So, along with their patents on the statin, they also filed patents on combination products, containing statins and supplementary CoQ10. But they never announced or marketed the combination product. Now, predictably, many statin users are suffering from the "side effect" of muscle wasting. And, instead of suggesting that people take a despised non-drug supplement like CoQ10 to protect those muscles, they just say look at the good side, your cholesterol numbers have been lowered.

    All of this stuff is available for confirmation through google or other search sites.

    Norb

     

     

     

  • 10-09-2009 2:05 AM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Norb Weckstein:
    And, instead of suggesting that people take a despised non-drug supplement like CoQ10 to protect those muscles, they just say look at the good side, your cholesterol numbers have been lowered.
    In the For What It's Worth category, Norb, for the past several years I've been taking eight pills twice a day, all are "supplements," none are prescription drugs, and all were recommended by my personal physicial/daughter: niacin, omega oil, CoQ10, saw palmetto, cranberry extract, vitamin B, vitamin C, and calcium with D.  The niacin and omega oil seem to have lowered my cholesterol without the need for a statin. 

    "Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.  Inside of a dog it's too dark to read."  --Groucho Marx

  • 10-09-2009 4:27 AM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Dave Hanson:

    In the For What It's Worth category, Norb, for the past several years I've been taking eight pills twice a day, all are "supplements," none are prescription drugs, and all were recommended by my personal physicial/daughter: niacin, omega oil, CoQ10, saw palmetto, cranberry extract, vitamin B, vitamin C, and calcium with D.  The niacin and omega oil seem to have lowered my cholesterol without the need for a statin. 

     

    Dave, 

    Congratulations! And complements to your brilliant physician daughter. One other one I have been using, on the recommendation of one of my physicians, is Nattokinase. Its specific effect is as a clot dissolver, and it therefore offers potential protection against strokes. It is technically not a blood thinner, but it should not be used if the person is also using a blood thinner like Coumadin (Warfarin). BTW, when niacin is taken, it produces a slightly uncomfortable temporary facial "flush" in some folks, so some docs say niacinamide, which does not produce that flush, is probably good enough to get the cholesterol lowering effect.

    There is some potential bad news on the horizon. Under the direction of Health Committee Chairman Henry Waxman (D) CA and John Dingell (D) MI,  who incidently also applauded the FDA goon squad attacks that I referred to earlier, the House has recently approved HR 2749, which is deceptively called the Food Safety Enhancment Act of 2009. Actually, it is a chilling instrument that can be used against supplement and organic food producers, filled with vague wording that the FDA is able to interpret as they wish, and penalties more than triple what the law presently permits. One nicety in it is that it gives the FDA authority to conduct random, warrantless searches of all product records, at any time, and without any evidence that there has been a violation - a powerful weapon of intimidation and harassment. Hopefully, the Senate will reject it. Generally, Senator Orrin Hatch, (R) Utah, who is a friend of the supplement industry, has so far been able to squelch these attacks on the Proxmire Amendment, and he is respected on both sides of the aisle.

    P.S. I just can't seem to issue short comments, can I? Guess I'm just a windbag.

    Norb

     

     

  • 10-09-2009 7:07 AM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    I took a picture of the above mentioned sunrise and tried to post it here, but it displays so huge that the effect was lost so I just deleted it.  I'm not computer savvy enough to downsize it.  Maybe I'll try posting it on my profile.... 

    Okay, that worked.  It's on my profile.  All I wanted to do was display a simple little picture and it uploaded so huge that I could count each individual pixel.  Good grief -- why does computer stuff have to be so confusing?  I'm assuming that it is confusing to the rest of you...  It is confusing to the rest of you, isn't it?  Please, Please tell me that computers confuse you....  I don't want to be all alone here....

     

  • 10-09-2009 7:26 AM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

    Dr. Dave to Norb..."In the For What It's Worth category, Norb, for the past several years I've been taking eight pills twice a day, all are "supplements," none are prescription drugs, and all were recommended by my personal physicial/daughter: niacin, omega oil, CoQ10, saw palmetto, cranberry extract, vitamin B, vitamin C, and calcium with D.  The niacin and omega oil seem to have lowered my cholesterol without the need for a statin.

    Hey Dave, your daughter sure seems to have it going on. I applaud your supplement menu. It has been my contention early on that "organic" trumps man-made hands down, due to the bodies ability to break organic-anything down and use it, as opposed to passing through our system partially unused as many prescriptions do. You hike like a gazelle, teach 22 hours per day, and still have time to be so dang smart. I'm still clapping for you as I finish this post. Good on you sir. Gip

    Keep your eye on the balland swing it like you mean it.

  • 10-09-2009 7:29 AM In reply to

    Re: Swine flu vaccinations: Oct. 5-12

     

    Clonnie Yearout:

     

     Oh my Gosh! Clonnie speechless? As the French would say, impossible!

    P.S. I trust that you are really OK!

    Update: It was only a temporary blank page, while he tried to trap the essence of the sunrise for us to enjoy. I kind of knew we could depend on him for actual content.

     

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