A group of physicians critical of Carilion Clinic is shifting its agenda by forming a new group that represents a broader citizenry.

Members of the physicians group  Coalition for Responsible Healthcare   have spearheaded an effort to start a sister organization,  the Citizen Coalition for Responsible Healthcare.

“We’re stepping back to allow other people get involved,” said Dr. Geoff Harter , president of the original coalition. “We want to portray this not as being a one-man campaign and really morph our efforts into  the Citizen Coalition for Responsible Healthcare.”

The citizens group, which as of Monday had not been incorporated, is holding a 7 p.m. meeting today at the Ramada Inn at 1927 Franklin Road  to unveil its leadership and plans for examining the effect Carilion has on regional health care.

Discuss the new groups and the effort to examine Carilion's effect on health care in the region.

 It is a shame to watch the self-destructive nature of folks in Roanoke.  Roanoke is a town without employment oppurtunities much above the $6.00 per hour figure.  Here we have an employer, employing approxamately 11,000 people, from all walks of life, with a variety of educational backgrounds, and all those in Roanoke want to do is complain and bicker about them.  As to the monopoly arguement, Carilion is the only place to go that will except those with no means or intention of paying for their medical care.  Carilion provides them with expert medical care, of the same caliber as those that can pay for their medical care.  If Lewis Gale wants to open it's doors to the homeless and indigent, as Carilion has, then maybe they will have a right to complain.  Tell me where all of these self-rightous folks were when Lewis Gale Clinic went bankrupt, failing to pay all it's local creditiors, but reopened under Lewis Gale Hospital with all the same doctors, equipment and in the same building.  If you were truely for responsible health care, why did we not hear from you then. 

I agree with you 100 percent. My gripe, and I've heard the same issue with many of my family, friends and coworkers, is with Carilion's extremely agressive billing department. I had two rather small bills and before my insurance company could work out their payment part, I was being threatened to be sent to a collection agency by Carilion! Seriously, I'd get a bill EVERY OTHER DAY for the same and sometimes different amounts for the same service. Each time a letter arrived it would be more hostile. I contacted them and PAID 150.00 of a 385.00 bill and 3 days later got another letter threatening FURTHER ACTION! It's been just a little over 30 days since my appt.

This is a clear warning to Me:  I know now that I had better not go to Carilion if any health problems arise in my life.  We are a country that continues to deny a full quarter of it's population any form of reliable health care.  There are those who have tried to revamp our badly broken health system, only to get shut down by cries of "Socialism."  Meanwhile we don't flinch at the socialism in the housing loan business in the US.  What is the overhaul of the housing mortgage and loan system, (Fannie-Mae & Freddie-Mac), but socialism.  Indeed, if it weren't for the "socialism" in America, we would truly be in much worse shape, or have no nation at all.

The only way we will EVER have decent health care in this country is when ALL healthcare and ALL insurance is rendered Non-profit!  When profit is on the table, any consideration for the health and well-being of others takes second place, or worse.  Social health care is the only option.  As a nation, It will be the best move we could ever take.

I'd like to respond to 'Silver Wind':

     I worked in health care for 16 years, with part of that in one of Carilion's emergency rooms.  The number of uninsured patients coming in with colds, sore throats, and other minor illnesses was overwhelming.  A direct abuse of the 911 system (we called it the "911 taxi service") by poor people without transportation was seen constantly by the ER staff.  People coming into the ER just to get work excuses, or a shot of Demerol, or a place to spend 6 or 7 hours out of the weather was a regular occurrence. Holidays or days just before snowfall was forecast saw a huge jump in this patient demographic.  As a nurse on a medical/surgical floor, I saw weeks upon weeks of hospital stays by regulars (patients we referred to as 'frequent flyers') who had no insurance - "self-pay" it would say on their charts - for things like alcohol detox, poor diabetes care, dementia due to alcoholism or drug abuse -  you name it.  While working on the diabetic floor I regularly stopped friends and family members from bringing in sweets or other unhealthy foods to our diabetic patients.  Removing candy and other snacks from the bedside table of a diabetic patient was nothing out of the ordinary for us.

     Yes, there are genuine cases of uninsured patients who truly need costly medical intervention, and Carilion regularly provides these people with great care whether or not they'll be able to pay for it.  Try getting that sort of upfront, state of the art care in any other country when you say you have no money to pay your bill! 

     I've been without health insurance in my younger days and I put away money 'just in case'.  Even if I could only save $5.00 a month, I was taking responsibility for myself by preparing for the unexpected.  I KNEW I didn't have insurance, but never expected someone else to foot my bill! 

     This sort of mindset burns my behind!  I have private health care through my employer that I help pay for.  My portion has exponentially risen in the past 10 years in an attempt to offset the huge number of unpaid medical expenses those without insurance incur.

     What about THIS mindset:  if you don't have insurance, SAVE whatever you can to at least make a 'good faith' effort to pay medical bills. If you can afford a tattoo and a pack of cigarettes, you can put away $25.00 a month towards health care expenses.  If your finances are in such terrible shape that you can't even afford a car, DON'T have children!!  Why bring a child into poverty?  Is that fair?

     Are we supposed to feel sorry for these people in this article because they got themselves in the situation they are in?  Take RESPONSIBILITY for yourselves, America!

…In response to “cyclingmad1”

I too, have been in health care, for 22 years as a counselor.  I paid into the health care system every paycheck, for all of those 22 years.  Now I am unemployed, and my health care?  Stopped!  Nada.  Zero health care coverage.  I stop paying, the health care goes away.  In more developed countries, ie: Northern European Countries and Scandinavian countries, health care is there for you, for the rest of your life.

In all fairness, there are those with high recidivism in any care system.  The clients I have dealt with for 22 years are hard-pressed to get the same care as someone sporting a health insurance card: usually no health insurance means you will be dismissed to the street after only a cursory once-over.

I have paid out-of-pocket for health care also:  I, personally, have had the opportunity to go to Canada for elective surgery. I was told to bring a grand total of $10.00, (ten dollars), for ALL medication needs during my stay. 

I was given a room with excellent nursing care, (for example, 2 nurses on duty for every 8 patients, on the 3^rd shift).  I paid all surgery and post-op care in ONE BILL.  HALF the cost for the same procedure stateside. For months afterward I did not continue to get bills for anesthesia, labs, pathology, etc., etc., etc.  If I rang for a nurse, she was there in an instant.  I could go on, but you get the idea.

We have a health care system for the rich and well-connected.  We desperately need a health care system for everyone else.

SW:

     No one disagrees that there is not major room for improvement in our nation's approach to health care in general.  Our population is primarily to blame for the high cost of health insurance and health care.  We are reactive instead of proactive in this country.  Instead of taking care of ourselves, we do, eat, and drink what we want, nevermind the consequences of a long period of sedentary living and poor diet.  This returns me to my original point; Americans must begin to take ownership and responsibilty for themselves. I doubt you lost your insurance the day your left your job, because anyone with insurance through a group of 9 or more people is eligible to buy into a COBRA policy.  Yes, that's expensive, but again, why do you think costs have risen so wildly?  It is not just because of the profit factor (by the way, Carilion is a non-profit system, whereas Lewis Gale is FOR profit and does turn patients away - guess where they go?) but is mostly because of the tremendous burden those of us who foot other peoples' bills must suffer.  Another group of people who receive health care are illegal immigrants and their babies who are born here - who pays for them?  I am neither "rich", nor "well connected", but I've never left any type of debt - medical bills or others - unpaid.

     Oh, and by the way, I doubt that the Canadian citizens (who paid for your 'affordable treatment' in their country) would be too pleased to hear your story.  I guess you would prefer if we ALL paid for those who don't pay their way, just like they do in Canada.

You are missing the whole point.  You may be willing to spend hundreds each month to prop up 10 to 20 percent yearly growth in the medical conglomerates rather than spend the same to guarantee health care for all, for the rest of your life, but I am not.  I would much rather spend, likely less, to ensure adequate health care for all, for the rest of our lives.  Think of the peace of mind of not having to worry about how we will provide for our own health needs in our golden years!  That alone is worth plenty!

OH, …And please read my last comment again.  No one paid for my elective procedure but me, fully HALF of what it would have cost me in the US,  with no "other costs" haunting me for months afterward.

Silver Wind:

 

You are missing the whole point.  You may be willing to spend hundreds each month to prop up 10 to 20 percent yearly growth in the medical conglomerates rather than spend the same to guarantee health care for all, for the rest of your life, but I am not.  I would much rather spend, likely less, to ensure adequate health care for all, for the rest of our lives.  Think of the peace of mind of not having to worry about how we will provide for our own health needs in our golden years!  That alone is worth plenty!

 

OH, …And please read my last comment again.  No one paid for my elective procedure but me, fully HALF of what it would have cost me in the US,  with no "other costs" haunting me for months afterward.

 

So...how do you think it cost half as much?   Did revenue from the Canadian Health care Tax (translation:  Canadians' money) pay anything to supplement the cost of your care?  Do all the major medical and pharmaceutical companies give Canadian hospitals and doctors a deep discount on their supplies, medicines and equipment, just because they have socialized medicine?  As I said, I agree that the system is badly bent, but it isn't as broken as people who want socialized medicine think it is.  Redundant billing, inefficient communication between hospital, doctor, surgical and other billing systems cost millions and are one of the reasons patients receive bills for months after care.  That is just one example in the flawed health care industry, but socialized health care is not the answer.  Privately, there is a national,chronic shortage of all nurses and many, many specialists - neurologists, psychiatrists, pediatric oncologists, pulmonologists, orthopedic surgeons - just to name a few.  How do you propose we handle the huge onslaught of patients who will seek out care from these physicians once health care becomes a public affair?  How will our health care providers take care of these patients?

 You are certainly making war on health care that everyone benefit from. 

My proceedure in Canada costs half as much because there is not the huge conglomerate of insurance companies soaking up profits, the pharmaceuticals soaking up enormous profits, etc..

And the doctors in Canada don't have 3 homes, a Porsche in the garage and a Mercedes for the Wife, oh and the boat...

The only thing wrong with the health care in this country is the above.  All profit should be taken out of the health care picture.  Bc/Bs/ trigon just "anexed" a half dozen acres at Broad Street and Staples Mill in Richmond, and built a huge facility,  Having to hide the money they are making on saps like us.  Doctor's hospital in Richmond is building a huge cardiac care facility on Glenside in Richmond...just to hide the money in "Re-investment."   That's where the money is going, stuffing the walets of the health care industry.  If less money than we pay into health insurance went into a much more efficient and streamlined system through the Federal Government, we would have adequate care.  As it is now only the rich and well-employed get ANY health care, because we all have to pay to the health care system for 1/10 of the services that Canadians get, for less money.

The Federal Government just this week bailed out practically the entire big-money brokerages, what is this but socialized banking?  Just like the social Post Office, the social police Dept.  the social ..I could go on, but then we would be talking about "Corporate Welfare,"  and everyone knows THAT doesn't happen!!

Wake Up!

What's going on here?

I hear your pain when it comes to socialized health care.  What are you afraid of?  The form of health care that we have now does not work. For quite a few years we have been hearing people say that the health care system can fix itself.  It has not.  Why not try something different?  All we are talking about is taking the PROFIT out of health care.  There are many, (arguably many in this country),  doctors and nurses in other countries that are in health care to help others.  That is all.

What are you afraid of?  What are you afraid of losing?

 
"In more developed countries, ie: Northern European Countries and Scandinavian countries, health care is there for you, for the rest of your life."

What a joke. 

Barack Hussein 0bama wants US to pay for the health care of ILLEGAL aliens.  Period, end of story.  How is THAT going to make it better?

Answer: It isn't.......because we are ALREADY paying for them, hence the HIGH rates RIGHT NOW.  Hospitals are closing in southern Texas and California because of Illegals.  

Look at the numbers he cites for coverage of ALL of the un-insured.  He is including illegal aliens.  Mexicans. 

Great people, I am sure, but why should YOU have to pay their doctor bill?

Silver Wind, go back to the SOCIALIST nightmare you came from.

BTW, I agree with cycling mad and the others who have defended Carilion, Yes, things could be better, but not by further dumbing down our health care providers.  Look at Canada for the sake of Pete! 

"I died waiting to see the doctor"

What in Heaven’s name are you talking about?

Please do not draw everything into this argument, including the kitchen sink!

Lets keep it where this discussion belongs..  about health care.

You are trying to cover way too much ground.

The US just converted to socialized financing.  Social is not a dirty word:

We have a social postal system, social police departments, social fire departments… I am sure you would not want to part with any of THESE systems.  

When you say:  “…social nightmare…”   Where does all of that ANGER come from?

I will ask again….  WHAT ARE YOU AFRAID OF… ? 

The only thing that I can think of is that you believe all of the propaganda that has been coming out of the Republican party for the past couple of decades.  It is propaganda, plain and simple, a myth! 

There are no “nightmares” in the health care system in the U.K., or Canada, or Belgium, or Finland, or Sweden, etc., etc.

" Dr. Steffie Woolhandler of Harvard Medical School points out that "we are already spending enough to provide every American with superb medical care - $5,775 per person this year [2003]. That's 42% higher than in Switzerland, which has the world's second most expensive health care system, and 83% higher than in Canada." Indeed, 14.9 percent of our gross domestic product is spent on health care and the cost is growing rapidly. Japan spends 7.6% of its GDP, Australia 8.5%, Holland 8.6% and Canada 9.5%. By 2013, per capita health care spending in the U.S. is projected to increase to 18.4 percent of GDP.

A recent study by David U. Himmelstein, MD and Dr. Woolhandler found that our current system is wasteful and obstructively bureaucratic:

Over 24% of every health care dollar goes to paperwork, overhead2, CEO salaries, profits, and other non-clinical costs. Because the U.S. does not have a system that serves everyone and instead has over 1,500 different insurance plans, each with their own marketing, paperwork, enrollment, premiums, rules, and regulations, our insurance system is both extremely complex and fragmented. The Medicare program operates with just 3% overhead, compared to 15% to 25% overhead at a typical HMO.

"

A typical look at our health care system.   --PH