Michael, you wrote:

What these forces will bring in our community is yet to be seen, but -- against all odds -- I'm hopeful. I believe that it's at least possible that as our collective need grows, so too will our compassion. I'd like to believe that we can all learn to think less about ourselves and more about others. After all, if we can manage that, maybe we'll come out of a period of having less and find that we have more than ever before.

I liked your post, but especially this part, where perhaps through all of this we will find compassion for others. It was nice to be reminded that there just might be a silver lining in all of this. Thanks.

Sean,

Thanks for your kind words. What's notable to me is that this seems to be a thread through many of the posts here. Lots of folks seem to be recognizing that we've been on a bit of a binge for quite some time -- buying and consuming far beyond our means. Maybe the recession will be our purgative, some nasty medicine that will set us right again.

Let's hope so.

Thanks again.

Michael

Cheri Hartman:

 Deb,

I love your story and your sense of the human spirit's capacity for generosity even in and maybe especially during difficult times.  It was well written - as alwyas I love your use of language to make a thoughtful point.

Happy New Year!

Cheri Hartman

 

 

Cheri,

Thank you for your kind words. We continue to have much in common as evidenced by our participation in this reader panel! I enjoyed your article very much and know first hand of your passionate commitment to improving lives in this community.  

Best wishes,

Deb 

Thanks, Joe, for being interested enough to reply; I was hoping, however, that my "qualifying" use of the words "may be" would keep me out of hot water.

And, you are absolutely right in that many are suffering for what has been beyond their control.

Cheers.  Betty

Betty Price:

Thanks, Joe, for being interested enough to reply; I was hoping, however, that my "qualifying" use of the words "may be" would keep me out of hot water.

And, you are absolutely right in that many are suffering for what has been beyond their control.

 

Cheers.  Betty

Betty,

    I hope you didn't view my comment as a criticism of your post.  I thought your post was excellent - I was commenting on the overall state of things with suffering being unequally shared. 

Joe

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How is the recession affecting you or your community now, and how do you fear it will affect you in the future?

About half the paper value of our investments has disappeared and with that comes a significant drop in dividends.  Still, we are better off than many, since our retirement income is essentially untouched and we have no jobs to lose, and no debt..  As one of my colleagues commented last week, I retired at the right time.  I am of course affected by the gloom that hangs over much of Virginia Tech.  Even more distressing are the severe cuts in state-funded support positions in public education across the Commonwealth.  Thousands of custodians, cafeteria workers, etc. will lose their jobs, and many of them are among the most economically vulnerable Virginians. 

The recession is, at least largely, the result of forces beyond Richmond’s control, but the lack of state resources to soften the blow is not.  The cupboard is bare because of the culpable failure of the General Assembly to stock it.

Several panelists have referred to FDR’s New Deal programs, pointing out that they, by themselves, did not end the Great Depression.  That, of course, is correct, not because the programs were misguided, but because they were too timid.  What really ended the depression was World War II.  Actually it wasn’t the war itself.  If we had mobilized all those people, marched them in circles and taught them Spanish, and built all the guns and planes and ships and then just scrapped them, it still would have worked for our economy, if not for the rest of the world.  We were pulled from the depression, and turned into the world’s military, economic, and social superpower, by massive deficit spending and very high taxes. 

Lisa,  You are so right!  We as a nation have been living on more than we make for a long time and now it's time for correction.  Mr. Yearout put it well on his post also.  We need to get back to budgeting and saving.  Cutting up credit cards is another great idea.  Reading your post makes me think about Dave Ramsey.  He could teach the government a thing or two!  If you've never checked it out before, his web site is www.daveramsey.com.  DAVE ROCKS!

Many people do not even consider the possibility of this worst case scenario, but I beleive we all should. The greatest partisan political myth is that Republicans (the party) are fiscal conservatives. Fiscal conservatives do not spend freely and depend upon borrowed money  for subsistence. The current administration has burdened us with the largest national debt in history and it appears that the deficit will be increasing, no matter which political party is in control. Who will bail out the U.S.A. if the country faces financial collapse after overextending its credit and resources, and bailing out its favored industries?

Wiwekart and a few others have touched on the "defining" of the major parties.  It seems to me that blindly adhering to old political allegiences, without examining their present positions, is part of this folly.  I agree that republicans are not monetarily conservative.  I also suspect that their fiscal "policies" are no longer appropriate for our times.  The labels conservative and liberal are likewise intertwined.  I don't have any answers here, but as a people being goverened, I think our real responsibility is to examine the message - and the actions - before making decisions.  I agree that some of the bailout money has already been misspent.  The point of maintaining the status quo of some of these huge fiscal entities is puzzeling to me.  I understand that their collapse may cause even greater hardship and difficulties, but I think the ultimate goal should be a remaking of our economy and way of thinking.  Not putting fingers in the dike.

"Many people do not even consider the possibility of this worst case scenario, but I beleive we all should. The greatest partisan political myth is that Republicans (the party) are fiscal conservatives. Fiscal conservatives do not spend freely and depend upon borrowed money  for subsistence. The current administration has burdened us with the largest national debt in history and it appears that the deficit will be increasing, no matter which political party is in control. Who will bail out the U.S.A. if the country faces financial collapse after overextending its credit and resources, and bailing out its favored industries?"

The above  is from Wiwekarts posting:  sorry about the confusion!

Wiwekart and a few others have touched on the "defining" of the major parties.  It seems to me that blindly adhering to old political allegiences, without examining their present positions, is part of this folly.  I agree that republicans are not monetarily conservative.  I also suspect that their fiscal "policies" are no longer appropriate for our times.  The labels conservative and liberal are likewise intertwined.  I don't have any answers here, but as a people being goverened, I think our real responsibility is to examine the message - and the actions - before making decisions.  I agree that some of the bailout money has already been misspent.  The point of maintaining the status quo of some of these huge fiscal entities is puzzeling to me.  I understand that their collapse may cause even greater hardship and difficulties, but I think the ultimate goal should be a remaking of our economy and way of thinking.  Not putting fingers in the dike.

robinhinrichs:

I understand that their collapse may cause even greater hardship and difficulties, but I think the ultimate goal should be a remaking of our economy and way of thinking.

Hey, Robin --

I'm conflicted on this kind of thing, as well. I was particularly confounded by the pleas of the Big Three automakers. It seems to me as though they have had their heads stuck in the sand for years -- if not decades. And it's not as though their dire circumstances came overnight, is it? I think a lot of us want Chrysler to "take their medicine."

And yet, another part of me recognizes that Chrysler is more than an entity. Chrysler is 46,000 people, probably much like you and me. They didn't steer the company onto the shoals. They simply showed up and worked the lines (though perhaps they might have recognized how out-of-step their union representation had become). Do we want these folks to take the same medicine?

I posted a blog entry about this kind of thing a while back. If you're interested, it's here.

I think this is the kind of moral conflict we're going to be feeling more and more for the next few years, don't you?

Michael

Harlan Miller:

Even more distressing are the severe cuts in state-funded support positions in public education across the Commonwealth.  Thousands of custodians, cafeteria workers, etc. will lose their jobs, and many of them are among the most economically vulnerable Virginians. 

Absolutely right, Harlan. In fact, back in the summer when gas was $4 a gallon, there were many of these same people who were taking vacation or sick days because they simply couldn't afford to drive to Blacksburg (where homes are overpriced) from their homes in West Virginia (where homes are more affordable).

Like many in the professional class, I tend to see the economic crisis in far more abstract terms. These are the folks who will feel it first, and will feel it most.

Michael

How is the recession affecting me?  So far, not very much.  I recently retired, have never been a gambler (i.e., I have shunned the stock market in favor of "bondage"), and am now a benefactor of  the social security system, that most wonderful legacy of Franklin Delano Roosevelt's New Deal.

Social security reminds me of the old adage: with crisis comes opportunity.  Just as the Great Depression led to so many humanistic reforms that are now an integral part of a healthy public life, so I harbor the audacious hope that our current global economic difficulties will bring the U.S. more fully into the last century, more for the sake of my children than for me.  Alone among developed nations, the U.S. lacks a national health care system, an extensive passenger rail system, and governmental restraints on the greed that is the natural impulse of an economic system that honors wealth through political favoritism.  The collapse of our financial system is a sad testament to the ideologically motivated loosening of governmental restraints on financial markets during the Clinton and Bush years.

Crisis may bring opportunity, but it brings danger as well.  The misery of the Great Depression unleashed destructive political forces that led to World War II.  We now live in the nuclear age, and my great fear is that economic instability will unleash furies that will threaten civilization. 

On a final hopeful note, World War II led to the end of the age of colonialism.  The sooner we accept that the age of U.S. global dominance is over, the sooner we can face up to our own economic and social stupidities and the self-defeating attitude, so distasteful to friend and foe alike, that we are so much better than everybody else.

 [

Jan Czarnecki:

Barb has been a real estate broker for 25 years, and I can never remember a time when she didn’t work, and work hard.  . . . , she never did anything “wrong.” 

My friends, neighbors, and acquaintances who have lost jobs or income are like Barb.  They worked hard to earn a modest income, they built small emergency funds or savings the hard way, five or ten dollars at a time.  A few are older, retired workers who had part-time jobs to boost erroding retiement income, to cover increasing medical costs, or to help children or grandchildren.  If they own stock, it is usually found in the pasture instead of a portfolio:  most would not recognize a Lexus if it ran over them, and dining out means an occasional biscuit or lunch at Hardee's or Burger King.  

I think too often, we envision those who have lost jobs, homes, or assets as characters from Bonfire of the Vanities.  Those I know, however, are like Barb -- hard-working people who did nothing wrong.             

 Alan,

I appreciate your concern for the impact of this economic crisis on our children and future generations. I feel that they will ultimately bear the brunt. For the last couple of decades, our society has been very consumer oriented and that is now ingrained as an unhealthy behavior and habit in many. Financial consequences for this attitude of consumerism were to just borrow more money. This recession has brought a keener sense of fiscal responsibility to most Americans. I am very, very hopeful that as we begin a new chapter tomorrow with President Obama, that there will be a bipartisan approach to correcting these serious financial problems for this country. We want to prevent this recession from turning into a depression, which I believe is entirely possible. Though a quick fix may be needed to prevent a depression, I am hopeful that whatever course is taken, the future generations will not pay the price for us.

Deb Landgraf

Michael Kiser:

And yet, another part of me recognizes that Chrysler is more than an entity. Chrysler is 46,000 people, probably much like you and me. They didn't steer the company onto the shoals. They simply showed up and worked the lines (though perhaps they might have recognized how out-of-step their union representation had become). Do we want these folks to take the same medicine?

Michael, thanks for the resonse.  You hit the nail on the head.  It is a moral dilemma, and who knows what the answer is.  Although I don't believe there can be a fix without some incredible hardship, I do believe it is our moral responsibility for those of us able to help others/entities, in some small way ( or big ones!)  It's tme for those who have more than they know what to do with to delve into a more altruistic lifestyle.  Well, a girls gotta dream, right?

Robin